Hosties

Well, I suppose using communion wafers in the place of croissants is better than using croissants in the place of communion wafers...

my agnostic friend used to call the hosts "Jeezits"

I can't believe this. It's beyond tacky.

There's nothing necessarily wrong with eating 'retails d'hosties'. Even the monasteries around here that make communion wafers sell the scraps. And as catechists we've used them. My mom certainly uses them when she does her lesson on the significance of bread. Among other things, using it helps the children see how much sense using it makes as opposed to using other bread stuff, as everything else makes tons of crumbs.
And it does taste good, and there's nothing sacriligious about it.

The modern liturgical movement has made a lot of the Mass mundane, bringing secular elements into worship with music and architecture and the like. The result is that one feels that there's not enough "other" or different about the Mass compared with the quotidian, ordinary business-as-usual. And there's also been an excessive focus on the Mass as meal and not sacrifice...

That having been said, the unfortunate thing is that the Eucharistic matter was meant to be something associated with ordinary life. The agape meals of the early Church were taken at home in a loving atmosphere of family and friends.

It's hard to really evaluate the idea of placing Eucharistic hosts into the pantry. On one hand, there's something of a value to the idea. But that value might be lost due to other circumstances of liturgical denegration.

like maria above, we have something similar in the philippines, but ours are coated with sugar. yum!

and they don't come as large (or small) circular hosts but rather bits of irregularly shaped wafer.

however, i'm not sure if the manufacturers made the wafers themeselves or sourced them from the scraps made by those who bake hosts.

Man my brother (a Catholic respecting evangelical) says he travels to montreal on business from time to time. Being somewhat of a Charismatic type of person he tells me the satanic grip on the area is palpable upon stepping off the airplane when he arrives. He absolutely hates traveling there..he does say the people are no different than anywhere else but feels the place is almost devoid of God.

I've got a great-aunt that's a canadian nun, and we got some trimmings from her, oh, 20 years ago. We ate them during a roadtrip to visit family in NH. Not being host-shaped, it didn't seem a problem, but now, I'd decline it. The texture and taste has a special time and place, and it's best to keep the experience untainted.

It's probably as sacreligious as reading the Bible whilst sitting on the loo, which I've also been guilty of. Mea Culpa, mea culpa mea maxima culpa..

Allo

I am a practicing catholic from Quebec, and even 20 years ago unconsecrated wafers were available in this fashion. They are quite good with maple syrup for example. My question is: Since The Good Lord shared bread and wine, not wafers and grape juice, what would be the problem with eating wafers? I would be surprised if wafers existed way back then. Were they not invented as a convenience for distribution at mass? Food for thought I think.

I used to help my mom take care of the flowers at church when I was a kid. Part of the thrill was to get to go into the sacristy where the unconsecrated hosts (and the watering cans for the flowers - hey, it was a very small church) were kept. I have to confess that once or twice (or maybe a few more times than that), I snitched a wafer or two because I liked the way that they tasted. My mother would have been appalled. Actually, had my mother found out there's a good chance I would not now be alive to type this.

As for the poster who made the comment about the ungodliness of Montreal -- I feel the exact same way about Santa Fe. The place is so new-agey ooey gooey weird that it just gives me the creeps. And to think that it started with such a strong Catholic foundation. . .

Say what you like, and try contorting yourself with every justification you can think of, but I agree entirely with the person who called it "a barometer of religious decline.

I found out recently that many of the swear words used by French Canadians derive from the words for the sacred vessels used at Mass and such.

With that in mind, I give this practice a "thumbs down."

These have been around for AGES, most places that make wafers recycle the extra bits, the cuttings from around the round parts and also imperfect ones. Early Christians would have baked special bread and used the leftover loaves to feed their families and maybe a family pet or chicken or two as well.... we need to stop looking for blasphemy in every small thing, this is no more a barometer of decline than other cultural traditions in other Catholic regions. Sheesh.

The Polish have a Christmas custom called "oblatek" which is sharing wafers that are the same material, taste and texture as communion wafers (although the ones I've always seen were not round but rectangular, and colored with food color in pale shades and had Christmas images imprinted on them). Also, legendary Nuremburger lebkuchen (soft gingerbread/nut cookies) available at Christmas are also baked on top of what appears to be large round communion wafers (at least it looks, tastes and has same texture.) I guess just the plain lebkuchen is too crumbly to bake on their own and would fall apart if you tried to pick it up.

Is that sacriligious? I don't know....

Being from Montreal, I feel compelled to comment on this.

First of all, the use of the round wafer in the photo seems staged. Most of the time the "retaille d'hostie" is the trimming around the cut-out wafers, and are not in a round shape, or are hosts that got shattered homehow.

Next, while this is an old custom here in Quebec, today most of the RdH that you can get here is actually not from manufacturers of hosts, but from bakeries. They are artificially sweetened, for example, and so would not be valid matter. Often this extra sugar colours the bread in an odd way, as the sugar caramelizes in the heat of the oven.

So it doesn't usually look like a host, and doesn't usually taste like a host. It strike me then that the problem, then, is with the reporting, not with the actual practice. It seems designed to delight in a "sacrilegious" practice that really isn't that bad in itself.

What fresh outrage is next? People drinking wine?

Next comment: regarding the "grip" Satan has on Montreal.....

Montreal, quite simply, is a city of strange destiny. It is part of why I love ministering here -- you really feel like you are living on the front lines of the spiritual war going on around us. It is kind of like living in Corinth in the time of Paul -- lots to denounce, and strongly, but lots to love as well.

On the one hand, you have the "spirit of this age" working in full swing, encouraging all kinds of strange and bizarre things like, errrr, swinging!

On the other hand, though, it is a city of saints. Many don't know this, but Montreal was founded in obendience to visions of the Blessed Virgin Mary received by Jerome le Royer in France in the 1600's. There are tombs of a dozen saints and blesseds within an easy driving distance, and major shrines and sites of pilgrimmage as well. The city is incredibly multicultural, letting us live the "catholicity" of the Church without even leaving the diocese.

I am very hopeful for this city, not only for its future as a city of faith, but for its potential contribution to the Catholic world.

The photo was weird, but...

Remember, wafers are a perfectly normal kind of food. The fact that most of us Americans only eat wafers at Communion (or in rectangular, cardboard-y sugar wafer form) blinds us to that fact. Wafers of all sorts were quite common in medieval, Renaissance, and late 18th-early 19th century cuisine, both alone and as a foundation for other recipes.

http://www.historicfood.com/Wafer.htm
Wafer making and wafer irons

"During the late medieval period and into the early renaissance, wafers were an important constituent of the void, or issue de table , the court ceremony at the end of a state meal. Wafers, comfits and hippocras were consumed by the sovereign in this semi-religious ritual linked with the final grace and the washing of hands. The hippocras and wafers may originally have had a quasi-eucharistic significance in that they echoed the Holy Communion. The spicy comfits were intended as ‘stomach settlers' to calm the royal digestion, though like both hippocras and wafers they later became luxurious treats consumed at all manner of celebratory occasions by those who could afford them."

http://www.deliciousitaly.com/ostia-wafer-recipe.htm
This page has an Italian wafer recipe

Just two more cents on the matter:

The word "host" is linked to the idea of immolation and sacrifice, and so, at the very least, the name is offensive.

Further, it doesn't seem that there's much of pious custom involved with this practice, whereas other examples cited at least have pretense of that if nothing else.

St Jimbob,

Why would reading the Holy Scriptures in the bathroom be necessarily sacrilegious? It makes me think of the legendary tale of the pious friar saying his offices in the lavatory. The Devil interjected "You can't do that!". To which the brother replied: "God receives what ascends, you may receive that which descends".

More to the point, I agree with Fr Dowd: the fault lies with the reporting.

kclo is right, the Nuernberger Lebkuchen are on top of such wafers. They are called "Oblaten" and are quite common in Germany. We do coconut cookies on top of them every christmas. When I was a child I did think it was the same thing as communion wafers, and was worried it might be wrong to eat them with coconut cream on, but actually, the communion wafers look different and don't really resemble the stuff we bake with.
But I wouldn't consider it quite appropriate to say it reminds me of mass when I eat them with tea...

This is just another ploy to desensitise us catholics to abuses and other uses for the body of christ. The placing of our Lordsy body in ones hand by a non consecrated person while standing up in place if kneeling was the first, along with changes to the form of consecration, and now the selling of wafers

Would one now be able to tell when our Lord is being desecrated in public a/k/a the e-bay sale of JPII hosts?

Is there or has there been any outcry over this? If one was selling Manachevits wine to be used as some sort of fodder, I would think you would have the Kosher community up in arms, but I have to guess that from what I hear from a friend who was recently in and left a seminary to go transfer to a traditional catholic one not in communion with Rome because he was being taught to doubt the real presence right there from his seminary teachers, some who were lay and others who were priests

Cynthia wrote: "Early Christians would have baked special bread and used the leftover loaves to feed their families and maybe a family pet or chicken or two as well...."

Where did you read this?

Every evidence I've ever read from the letters and writings of the Church Fathers shows profound respect and honor was given to the Lord in Eucharist. He was never 'fed to chickens' as far as I know, nor made into sandwiches for a light luncheon. All that I've read to date shows clearly that Eucharist was given such respect that It was hidden from all newcomers (who were removed from Holy Mass before the Consecration). Early Christians died brutal deaths rather than reveal Eucharist to anyone not already baptized into The Way.

I'm curious to find out the source for your ascertains.

The mostly Polish tradition of Oplatek (mentioned above by someone else) is a bit different from this discussion on hosts.

The Oplatek is basically small and rectangular, wafer-like in thickness and appearance, about 5"x7", usually with an image of the Last Supper or other holy image on it. The Oplatek is blessed (not consecrated!) by a priest. The Oplatek is designed to be exchanged at holiday celebrations as a symbol of love, health and good wishes. I wouldn't sit there and gorge on it, after all, it is a blessed item designed for use in a holiday / religious capacity, but it is not the consecrated body of Christ (nor does anyone who has participated in the tradition have the illusion that it is an actual consecrated host).

Anyhow, in my opinion:

Unblessed/unconsecrated hosts are just that...hosts. Flat unleavened bread, sweetened or whatever. In my line of thought, they are no different than a Saltine cracker or other similar food. As long as the hosts sold in stores don't have an image of holiness on them or have some blessing to them, they seem to be no different than any other food to me.

If anyone confuses these unconsecrated/unblessed hosts sold in stores with the real consecrated body of Christ, or if the sales of hosts in stores diminishes the Eucharistic importance in someone's mind, I might question that person's fundamental understanding or belief in the Eucharist itself.

Go to any kosher section of a grocery store...they sell unleavend bread, similar (although thicker) than our present day host...this is probably more accurate of what Christ actually consecrated and ate at that time (it was, after all, the Passover meal for Jesus and the disciples, and unleavened bread is prescribed in Exodus as a part of that meal).

There may be a side benefit. Little Catholic kids who grow up eating wafers w/syrup for breakfast won't have difficulty believing that what we use at Eucharist is supposed to be bread --- which is the difficult half of current teaching, the other half is easy, Jesus promised!

[And, yes, it's the big problem most of my first communion class had back in 1963.]

Many traditional Catholic cultures have different customs with respect to unconsecrated hosts. The term "retailles d'hostie" literally translates from the French (I think... as my last French lesson was over 25 years ago) into "recut hosts" so at least the term is being used in a literal fashion as opposed to a sacrilegious manner. Personally, I think the fact that the story was written to scandalize, to titillate, or to shock the conscience of Catholics is actually more of a barometer of declining respect for our faith than a particular custom. The fact that someone decided to commercially sell unconsecrated hosts is no more sacrilegious than people hawking St. Joseph aspirin, Bosco syrup, Lourdes holy water, or even pretzels which at one time had a religious significance to certain orders of monks. It doesn't appear that the retailers are selling the wafers to denigrate or deny a central aspect of out faith. And the practice is much less offensive to me than the stories I have heard about people selling consecrated hosts or religious relics on E-Bay or some other internet-based sales outfit.

Frankly, I think any thing, no matter how small or tenuous, that reminds us daily of Christ's sacrifice on the cross is more good than bad, especially in the USA where kids are being persecuted for wearing crosses to school or saying a prayer at a school function, where suits are being filed to stop the erection of crosses on the wayside for dead police officers or the erection of a creche in a park, and where millions of unborn children being put to death is called a civil liberty.

BTW, I am well aware of the reverence that should be given to a host. My daughter's name is Alethea, named after St. Aleth, the mother of St. Bernard, whose sybmol is the Viaticum.

Shana, I'm sure Cynthia was referring to the unconsecrated bread, whereas you seem to be referring to the consecrated hosts, which have always treated with great respect.

Sorry I misspelled 'retailles d'hostie'. Whoever said it's like a kind of speciality bread has it right. We don't buy it that often, because it's not cheap, but it's kind of like eating crackers or matzo (which we do get a lot, because it's cheaper than crackers). It's bread. And, as Fr. Tom said, it's almost never in a circular shape -- at least not a complete circle. If you're actually getting real host cuttings you might get circular ones with part cut out or something. I've never tasted the sweet ones to my knowledge.

Someone noted that French profanity has to do with religious things and it's true. Profanity is all about profaning that which is holy. Anglophones chose to profane sex and the body, and Francophones profane things connected to the mass. Somebody could write something really interesting about the respecting senses of the sacred in the two societies based on that (and then confirmed elsewhere).

I'm not sorry to say that I don't feel the grip of Satan thingy on my city. I love the history of its foundation. I love the vision it was founded with. I love the church of Ville Marie de Montreal. I love the churches of my city. I love Jesus in the blessed sacrament of the altar. I love the work our diocese is doing with the youth. I love the... desire for holiness I see in the youth who come to diocesan events. I love my parish, orthodox without being focussed on being 'orthodox', rather focussed on Christ.
I guess it depends where you focus. If I decided to list things I, ahem, don't love, my list would not have a hard time being just as long or longer. But I love my city, and I love my country.

I have a friend who eats the hosts right out of the bag like chips. She's a very good Catholic and finds it wonderful, and tasty. She says they're not consecrated so there shouldn't be a problem. True enough....but it still bugs me and I don't like the idea you can get the hosts and use them as anyone would wish, be it chips and dip or cake decorations. They are ment for one thing only in my book. It's like using an new scalpel as a steak knife. It cuts well enough, but it just looks wrong.

That's how I feel too, Lucy.

I would echo the sentiments of lucy and lynn - yet I would caution that they are just that: "sentiments."

On the other hand, people have such a reaction because these are things associated with the Mass and therefore with the Sacred.

Arguments certainly have been made that Jesus intended to use the most common, regular and ordinarily-available things (bread and wine) to transform into his body and blood, but again, I think the reaction (of Lucy and Lynn and many other posters here) is legitimate. For the same reason, I try, whenever possible, to use wine specifically labeled as Sacramental wine for the consecration - and for nothing else. I may like the taste of Mont La Salle Rosato, but I would never serve it at my supper table, likewise I may like the smell of incense, but I would resist the urge to burn it (or beeswax candles) around the house as this would have the effect of diminishing the responses (of the senses) connected with the sense of the Sacred. For the same reason I would never wear an overcoat designed on the same pattern as a chasuble (even if the chasbule, in its original gothic or conical form, was derived from some form of common (or aristocratic) Roman outerwear).

AS far as those (Catholic, or once-Catholic) places which have had a long tradition of using
a "host-like" bread for special confections, then perhaps the connections are different and such use indicates nothing as a barometer of religious belief. If such a thing were to be marketed in our cultural milieu, it could certainly be regarded as a barometer of religious decline.

Why am I reminded of the Leo Sayer clone from Saturday Night Fever?

"My girlfriend, faddah, she likes the taste of Communion wafers."

This just sickens me. If they're hungry, why not eat celery sticks? they're healthy. or even better, don't eat at all. heaven knows we all eat too much, anyway. but don't use unconsecrated hosts.

Thank you for posting this feature.
It's horrible to imagine that ANYBODY that claims to be a faithful Roman Catholic could even consider engaging in this blatant form of sacrilege against the Body of Our Lord.It's hard enough to make yourself ready for Confession as is without adding this type of heresy to the mix.
I have heard of all sorts of abuses inflicted on the Blessed Sacrament,everything from stealing It ,to people deliberately threatening to chew IT up and spit It out as a form of protest against the Church's policies and laws.
I have even heard that there is indeed a thriving ''black market'' for Consecrated Hosts;Only God Himself knows what they want Them for.
Also ,there are incidents of persons attempting to ''kidnap''Hosts right under the noses of the KofC
and the celebrant-priest during Mass,that had to be run down and apprehended.
What is wrong with these people?
They treat the greatest Gift and Miracle that God has ever bestowed upon man as if It were no more important than a bag of potato crisps.
I think that it's an archetypal example of the ''searing of consciences'' that the Lord Himself spoke of ,that would become prevalent in the Last Days.
Not only do people that should be falling down in worship before the Sacred Species,recieve in states of Mortal Sin,they now think of It as no more than a snack item.
These folks and their kids need to go back to Catechism ,Confession,and rediscover Who it is they are defiling with their casual indifference to His Passion.